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< The Library ~ The Half Blood Prince - What do you want to see? |
| anna_kat |
 Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:07 pm |
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Joined: 01 Jan 2005
Posts: 33
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Snape Fan wrote: and Snape does deserve some respect from him.
I disagree. I consider Snape's treatment of Harry and Neville his single biggest character flaw. He singled Harry out from Harry's very first day at school and never left out an opportunity to belittle Harry and Neville at 11 and at 15. He has done nothing to earn Harry's respect. Not even the respect his position would normally entitle him to.
When you are a teacher you do not set a student deliberately up to fail and you don't destroy their work out of sheer spite. No matter how enraged you might be. You don't do it. At 36 you don't have the same excuse for stupid behaviour as a teenager. I find teenagers exasperating and trying, but my measuring stick for adults and for teenagers is not the same.
Incidentally my biggest problem with Dumbledore is that he never calls Snape to task. When a student's biggest fear is a particular teacher, as headmaster you have to look into the matter. It is inexcusable in my eyes, that as headmaster he does not know or understand his teachers at all, and that he allows them such blatant abuse of power. It is very telling that none of the students complained about Umbridge's sadism while Dumbledore was still at Hogwarts. Clearly they knew that the headmaster would simply dismiss it.
Likewise, it is telling that he simply dismisses Snape's absolute and well justified hatred of the late James and the now late Sirius. I don't blame Snape for his hatred, not at all. I blame Dumbledore for not addressing the issue. Just as Snape should give guidance to Harry, but doesn't, Dumbledore should give guidance to Snape, and fails.
And then there is the very strange circumstance that he can only ever find people to guard and guide Harry, the alleged weapon against Voldemort, who hate the boy for either his mother or his father.
I know Dumbledore is on the side of the light but find him the most morally ambiguous character in the books. And yes, I too would like to know why Severus trusts him so much and vice versa.
This is not the threat for my rant against Dumbledore. I apologise. But coming from a family of teachers and headmasters (being one of the few who ventured outside the academic field) ethics and professionalism in the teaching business are deeply ingrained in me. I dearly wish book 6 or 7 would address Dumbledore's inability to understand human nature. |
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| Snape Fan |
| Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2005 10:52 pm |
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Joined: 28 Dec 2004
Posts: 29
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I agree with you about the way Snape treats Harry and Neville. It is wrong. But that does not negate the fact that Harry is just as rude and mean to Snape both to his face and behind his back. Even after Quirrell told him Snape was trying to save his life at quidditch, Harry chose not to factor that in in the way he sees Snape. Snape does need to be called to task for the way he treats students, and DD doesn't seem inclined to do it. But Harry also did his utmost not to do what Snape told him to do during the Occulmency lessons. Snape told him to call him Sir or Professor, not an unusual request I believe, and Harry saw that as some sort of personal vendetta. They both have huge issues.
But none of that excuses Harry's behavior in school. He is arrogant, he is selfish, he does break rules and a teacher is trying to correct that.
I also have different measuring sticks for adults and teenagers and having a teenager myself, there is no way I would ever let her treat any of her teachers the way Harry treats Snape. I also would not let them treat her the way Snape treats Harry. But my daughter is taught to show respect to every adult.
[quote]find people to guard and guide Harry, the alleged weapon against Voldemort hate the boy for either his mother or his father.Quote:
I haven't heard of anyone that really hates Lily, but I have noticed one thing about James and Lily. While everyone speaks highly of her, the only thing they can seem to say about James is that Harry looks a lot like him. Not high praise in my book.
I think there is still something sneaky about James we don't know about yet. |
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| Diana |
| Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2005 2:52 am |
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Head Moderator
Joined: 04 Jan 2005
Posts: 116
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Quote: I was about ready to slap Harry in book 5 and didn't blame Snape for one minute in how he treated him. I have a daughter about Harry's age and I would never, for one moment, put up with that kind of behavior from her. Someone needs to take him in hand and straighten him up.
Yes. This is true. I highly doubt that your daughter or any child Harry's age has the kind of pressures placed upon them that he is forced to face either. I was disturbed by Harry's behavior as well, but I wasn't shocked. I had been waiting for Harry to snap, I pretty much figured out that he was going to be obnoxious in book five considering the conclusion of book four.
Quote: Snape realising that Harry isn't James.
I would like to see that as well. I think the biggest misconception, by both fans and Snape himself, is Snape's hatred of Harry. Snape does not hate Harry, Snape hates James. Snape's only issue with Harry is that he is Jame Potter's son. He didn't even give Harry a chance at age eleven. If I were Harry I'd treat Snape like the prat he acts like, towards him, too.
Quote: Snape told him to call him Sir or Professor, not an unusual request I believe, and Harry saw that as some sort of personal vendetta. They both have huge issues.
In order to gain the right to request the use of those titles one has to first earn them. I understand that Snape is a deeply flawed character. I also understand that Harry is a deeply flawed character. The difference is clear however, Snape is an adult and Harry is a child. If anyone should be taking the first step here it is Snape. Respect garners respect. Snape started the cycle regardless of his dealings in book one. He wasn't saving Harry to be the hero, he was saving Harry to get out from under the life debt he owed to James Potter. This is mentioned in the books.
I cannot understand how some cannot see or understand what would possibly cause Harry to act out in the way he does. There is a raving lunatic out to kill him. This raving lunatic killed his parents and attempted to kill him at age one. This same raving lunatic attempted to kill him again at the age of eleven. Again at age fourteen. In addition to the attempts at taking Harry's life, this same raving lunatic and his evil posse have also deemed it necessary to have an eleven year old possessed, killed countless individuals, and one of them even took the last vesages of family Harry had left...his godfather. I just can't understand how people are unable to see all of this when taking into consideration the way Harry behaves. He was abused for the first ten years of his life. The absence of physical abuse does not mean that it was still not abuse. Taking this all into consideration I can see where Harry is coming from. I can also see where Snape is coming from, but then again about ninety percent of what is happening is kept from Harry, so I can see where he could suspect Snape...no one will tell him anything.
To get back to what we should be talking about...the topic at hand, I also want to know more about Lupin. In addition to Lupin I want to find out the fate of Wormtail. Oh, and Lucius Malfoy is so going to bust out from Azkaban, no matter how much I wish it weren't true. I can already see the wrting on the wall (pun not intended) so to speak. |
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| Snape Fan |
| Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2005 4:12 pm |
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Joined: 28 Dec 2004
Posts: 29
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I agree that my daughter or any other teenager has the issues that Harry has to deal with. That does not excuse him from not calling Snape Sir or Professor. I would expect the same of my daughter.
And yes while Harry has gone through his parents being killed an a madman out to kill him, that does not excuse some of his behavior. Look how he treated his friends at Grimmauld Place when he arrived. Or how he found out he wasn't a Prefect. He seemed to expect he would get it. Like no one else deserved it but him. Typical behavior for a teenager, but he blames Snape for it. I don't think Snape had anything to do with it - it was Dumbledore's decision.
Harry also never gave Snape a chance. He saw him as the bad guy after he saw the cut on his leg, and ran with the "fact" that it was Snape after the stone. From thereon, Snape was the bad guy.
Like you though, back to what we'd like to see in HBP. What did James and Sirius do after school? I'd also like to know why they befriended Peter in the first place. |
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| Mizzlsd |
| Posted: Tue Feb 15, 2005 1:45 pm |
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Joined: 10 Dec 2004
Posts: 8
Location: Torbay
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I'm afraid I'm not part of the very interesting debate but can I put my wishes for book 6.
1) Definitly more Snape, I'm surprised how popular this is. But I would love to know what he gets up to in the meetings and also about his background. We know he came from an aggressive background (OOTP) and I want to know how much of an influence that was.
2) More LUNA LOVEGOOD!!! I want to know if she finds the Crumpled Horn Snorkak. Also she is a very interesting character, and extremely funny.
3) I would love to know a bit more about the Marauders, especially Lupin, he is the most sensible. I would like to know more about James' past and why he was such a bully.
4) I do not want Sirius back, he really annoyed me.
5) Narcissa Malfoy, we know nothing so far, and she seems quite intruiging. I think she is more caring towards Draco, and I think she may be a bullied wife.
6) I know this isn't a very popular idea but I would love more "teenager" things to happen. Like, relationships. I really enjoyed the parts where we saw Harrys awkwardness towards Cho. I love Ron's jealousy when Hermione went out with Viktor, but I do not want them to end up together. I think Hermione should go for someone with more intelligence, but unfortunately JK will definitly not do a teacher/student pairing.
7) More Draco Malfoy. He is a very entertaining character but I think he'll decide where his loyalties lie. But with the final "Your dead Potter" I think he already has.
Well thats basically them all.  |
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| Iseult |
| Posted: Sat Mar 26, 2005 7:40 am |
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Joined: 20 Feb 2005
Posts: 20
Location: Newcastle, Australia
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1. Lucius not buying his way out of prison. Draco's status reduced.
2. Further development of Neville. More confidence? An attempot to resolve the situation of his parents.
3. More Hagrid. I have missed him in the last couple of books. He has played such a crucial role in Harry's life and was the first person to befriend him and shoe him kindness.
4. Dumbledore's Army in the open. Either development of a Defence Association, along the lines of a duelling club or DA broadened to involve those who want to develop their much needed defense skills.
5. How magical society reacts to the Death Eater attack. It happened in the Ministry! Can they really ignore it? How do students/parents/staff react?
6. Subsequent to this, more support for Dumbledore. Boosting the strength of OOTP and the protection of students.
7. The development of Snape. I don't think he'll get DADA. Elevation to hero status (secret hero status of course).
8. Personally I object to the idea of explanations for magical spells. We know the wand movement for Wingardium Leviosa but is that what really makes it work. It's MAGIC! Just accept the blind leap of faith. We are getting HP book 6 not a dissertation on magical theory.
9. Harry told to get a grip strategies to support this.
10. The DADA has to be competent. I don't care if it a auror, an adult Weasley.
11. Some hints of positive Slytherin ambition.
12. Karma coming to a Percy Weasley near you.[/list] |
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| illaria |
| Posted: Fri May 20, 2005 10:59 am |
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Joined: 18 May 2005
Posts: 19
Location: Test Valley, New Forrest on the Hants/Wilts border!
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1. More about Snape, his history, why he joined Voldermort in more detail, where his true loyalties lay, whether or not he may be a real double agent (Im not expecting this, not really, I don't think we'll actually get to hear more about it until towards the end of book seven)
2. The history of the Pureblood families, how they are interlinked and who is allied with whom.
3. More about the Marauders, how their friendship started and why, and the reasons for the rivalries between Snape and the Marauders.
4. Why was Sirius sorted into Gryffindor when all his family, the Blacks, Malfoys, LeStranges were Slytherin, why and how he came to be part of the Order.
4. I really agree with the "Teenage things, like relationships" someone mentioned, I think people forget that they are actually only fifteen and not twenty because their lives have been so hectic and heroic. There should definitly be more love interest and pairings.
5. What is the deal with Dumbledore? I know there was a prophecy made about only Harry being able to kill him, but if Dumbledore was the only one Voldermort was ever afraid of and he is as into the cause of the OoTP as he claims to be, then why didn't he try and kill him before that.
6. I'd love to see The trio turn into animagi, I'd be really interested to know what animals they would be able to take on.
Its quite a lot of things to want I guess, but there you go, i must just be really nosey eh? lol |
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